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"A PWNA conversation"for members and non members
- Thread starter Dan S
- Start date
Larry L.
PWN TEAM - Moderator Emeritus
guess what was my point huh,
Like any group,you have to be active before you can benetfit,cann't pay your membership and set back like alot of them do.I'm smart enough to know "if" I wanted more the 200 dallors would be peanuts as to what I could gain.I've never been againest any group,they all have their place as to what they want to do or can do.
The 600(m) cut to the EPA will hurt what the pwna are trying to do,plus I think other government place mats will be cut also.The pwna is a fighter and it will take more active members to win the battle its fighting,like you say,they just have a few thats active...maybe someday we'll all be active members huh.
Like any group,you have to be active before you can benetfit,cann't pay your membership and set back like alot of them do.I'm smart enough to know "if" I wanted more the 200 dallors would be peanuts as to what I could gain.I've never been againest any group,they all have their place as to what they want to do or can do.
The 600(m) cut to the EPA will hurt what the pwna are trying to do,plus I think other government place mats will be cut also.The pwna is a fighter and it will take more active members to win the battle its fighting,like you say,they just have a few thats active...maybe someday we'll all be active members huh.
Henry Bockman
Member
Hey Larry,
I'm suprised you don't use the xjet more, its really a great tool. I'd never try telling anyone that they "need" to join the PWNA. Some people will get somthing out of it and some won't. In most cases you only get out of stuff like this what you put into it. As for 3,000 members on the bbs that's pretty impressive but How many of them consistantly post? I think that's a similiar thing to why not many pwna members are responding to this thread. Were all just too busy to deal with luxury items like time...lol
I doubt this thread is going to get anyone to join the PWNA and if it does that wasnt my intention at all believe it or not. I was just trying to get people to think about it and check into it so they can make up their own minds about it. Either way, people can still get a lot of useful information about Power washing on the PWNA bbs just like they do on this one.
I'm suprised you don't use the xjet more, its really a great tool. I'd never try telling anyone that they "need" to join the PWNA. Some people will get somthing out of it and some won't. In most cases you only get out of stuff like this what you put into it. As for 3,000 members on the bbs that's pretty impressive but How many of them consistantly post? I think that's a similiar thing to why not many pwna members are responding to this thread. Were all just too busy to deal with luxury items like time...lol
I doubt this thread is going to get anyone to join the PWNA and if it does that wasnt my intention at all believe it or not. I was just trying to get people to think about it and check into it so they can make up their own minds about it. Either way, people can still get a lot of useful information about Power washing on the PWNA bbs just like they do on this one.
Larry L.
PWN TEAM - Moderator Emeritus
yeah maybe I need to knock the rust off it.
I can see were being a businessman and a active member any time they get would be luxrury time.
I think your wrong about this thread,I doubt you have read the hold thread as to my meaning.
Playing number games is for kids,450 came first 3500 came second.
I can see were being a businessman and a active member any time they get would be luxrury time.
I think your wrong about this thread,I doubt you have read the hold thread as to my meaning.
Playing number games is for kids,450 came first 3500 came second.
Clean County
New Member
I think this thread started I believe by Dan S. is a great one.
I am a believer in when people start to question something this is when you can start to get things done. If nobody question anything then PWNA as a group can become stagnant and that is a death trap.
If we get one person in this whole thread to join the PWNA then that is great. If we get a few more then even better but if we don't get any at least we can maybe get some idea's on how to improve this organization. That is my main goal when I enter threads like this because idea's never come freely to me since I am not very creative.
I hope some others add some imput here which is the reason why I put a post on PWNA bb asking for members to do just that. If they do thats great. If they don't thats fine also. Just keeping the dialog open among us is great.
I am a believer in when people start to question something this is when you can start to get things done. If nobody question anything then PWNA as a group can become stagnant and that is a death trap.
If we get one person in this whole thread to join the PWNA then that is great. If we get a few more then even better but if we don't get any at least we can maybe get some idea's on how to improve this organization. That is my main goal when I enter threads like this because idea's never come freely to me since I am not very creative.
I hope some others add some imput here which is the reason why I put a post on PWNA bb asking for members to do just that. If they do thats great. If they don't thats fine also. Just keeping the dialog open among us is great.
Doc Reisman
PWNA President
Larry L. said:
I am not completely sure the budget cut will hurt us, in fact (merely speculation) it may help us because they (the inspectors) will be more willing to listen to ideas to make there jobs easier. When I attended the Region 6 EPA conference I was amazed at how little many of the inspectors really understand what and how we perform our work. It seems most AHJ work under the premise of reaction rather then being proactive.
My primary goal is to develop a relationship with the officials so we the PW industry does not have to abide by ridiculous, stringent regulation. We can work to help write more realistic regulation (waste water / storm water.) Lets face it; we have competition from other sectors of PW especially the car wash industry. Many would love to see us out of business because we do not have the rules and regulation they have, due to our mobility.
I think many would be surprised at the conversations I am having with inspectors and how excited they are to have an organization (PWNA) wanting to work together to make things better.
I am also dealing with state fire inspectors associations that are ready to sign an agreement with PWNA to work together to better the industry; this will be the domino effect to catapult PWNA to the next recognition level.
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Larry L.
PWN TEAM - Moderator Emeritus
You may be right Doc,the cut may ever will but pwna to the next level,with that big of cut I'm sure the epa man power will be less.The man power inbehind the pwna will in fact take the place of a few of those,any time the government can save money they'll listen.The cut may be the new road the pwna has been looking for,if something isn't done the mobility of the powerwasher will be limited.It will be like the small mom and pops back in the old days..gone..only bigger will meet the rules.
good luck in your meetings
good luck in your meetings
Doc Reisman
PWNA President
Larry,
You and I are on the same page. I believe the industries voice should be grouped rather then having the voice of a few corporations.
PWNA is not looking to support the thoughts and ideas of a few companies we are looking to be a part of what the PW industry needs. It goes back to the old adage of voting. If you did not vote, don't waste your time complaining about who is in office.
The same goes for our industry; if PW do not join together to make changes, larger special interest groups (not just in our industry) will change things and it will not be for our benefit.
You and I are on the same page. I believe the industries voice should be grouped rather then having the voice of a few corporations.
PWNA is not looking to support the thoughts and ideas of a few companies we are looking to be a part of what the PW industry needs. It goes back to the old adage of voting. If you did not vote, don't waste your time complaining about who is in office.
The same goes for our industry; if PW do not join together to make changes, larger special interest groups (not just in our industry) will change things and it will not be for our benefit.
onecallpowerw
New Member
What Changes ?
The only thing that is shadowing the Power Washer's is the envionmental aspects. Correct me if I am wrong, but, does PWNA not have this in mind ? Before you know it, all Power Washers will have to go out and drop plenty of money to be enviromentally compliant. PWNA of course will be a strong backer of this.
This would even apply to the washer that lives in the most rural areas of our country. How will this benefit him/her ? He is probably on the verge of begging for work and having to expense several thousand dollars to become compliant.
Before anyone gets the idea that onecall does not comply. Think again. I spend my fair share on socks, pumps and payment to dump etc... Is it ridiculous ? Yes. Considering all the other enviromental mishaps that take place. Yes.
On the safety side on things, Yes PWNA does promote this. Although most safety issues are common sense. Already we pay for workmen comp, unemployment etc......What will happen next ? Safety Certification at a price mandated by the government and promoted by PWNA ?
What has organizations really got us ? You have the unions which have practically contracted themselves out of work.....They got greedy. The union employee got greedy and now he is all upset that the company left and went to mexico ? Come on.....Is this not where the PWNA wants to be (Power Washers of America Union)
Organizations work for one reason and one reason only. Either they have an agenda for the near future or they have one for the distant future. Which is PWNA ? Everytime PWNA meets or greets someone with the EPA or any other agency, company, association, it just puts us all out in the open. Doc, you say vote, vote for what ? More governmental control in the long run ? Believe me its coming with or without PWNA. PWNA will just make it happen sooner.
The only thing that is shadowing the Power Washer's is the envionmental aspects. Correct me if I am wrong, but, does PWNA not have this in mind ? Before you know it, all Power Washers will have to go out and drop plenty of money to be enviromentally compliant. PWNA of course will be a strong backer of this.
This would even apply to the washer that lives in the most rural areas of our country. How will this benefit him/her ? He is probably on the verge of begging for work and having to expense several thousand dollars to become compliant.
Before anyone gets the idea that onecall does not comply. Think again. I spend my fair share on socks, pumps and payment to dump etc... Is it ridiculous ? Yes. Considering all the other enviromental mishaps that take place. Yes.
On the safety side on things, Yes PWNA does promote this. Although most safety issues are common sense. Already we pay for workmen comp, unemployment etc......What will happen next ? Safety Certification at a price mandated by the government and promoted by PWNA ?
What has organizations really got us ? You have the unions which have practically contracted themselves out of work.....They got greedy. The union employee got greedy and now he is all upset that the company left and went to mexico ? Come on.....Is this not where the PWNA wants to be (Power Washers of America Union)
Organizations work for one reason and one reason only. Either they have an agenda for the near future or they have one for the distant future. Which is PWNA ? Everytime PWNA meets or greets someone with the EPA or any other agency, company, association, it just puts us all out in the open. Doc, you say vote, vote for what ? More governmental control in the long run ? Believe me its coming with or without PWNA. PWNA will just make it happen sooner.
Doc Reisman
PWNA President
The EPA is already doing their own thing whether we participate or not. Our goal is to make sure they do not over regulate our industry to the point we cannot make a living. The key word is "reasonable" regulation.
If the PW industry chooses to stay silent the governmental agencies will walk right over us.
True, we are getting in front of the EPA regulators and enforcers. The EPA has a plan in effect to make changes over the next few years. This means our window of opportunity is limited. We either talk to the officials now or spend many years afterwards lobbying for change.
I would much rather be out of in front of the group rather then playing catch-up.
If the PW industry chooses to stay silent the governmental agencies will walk right over us.
True, we are getting in front of the EPA regulators and enforcers. The EPA has a plan in effect to make changes over the next few years. This means our window of opportunity is limited. We either talk to the officials now or spend many years afterwards lobbying for change.
I would much rather be out of in front of the group rather then playing catch-up.
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Larry L.
PWN TEAM - Moderator Emeritus
Unfortunately the pwna doesn't have more people like Anne Burford,I think she had more sence than any of the monkeys setting on the hill.She was a former chief of the epa,she was forced to resign while President Reagan cracked nuts on the monkey hill.She cut the epa budget by 22 percent and slashed enforcement actions,promoting what she viewed as a more senible regulations.Thats where the pwna should be,they should have the titles of chiefs of the epa instead of trying to tell them what to do.Who else knows more about clean and what clean means other then a powerwasher/cleaners.I think they would be more enforcement of the clean water act than someone whats never cleaned before.Maybe the pwna needs to start climbing the latter and push someone into the head offices as in being big chief of the epa.
More then likely tho he/she would be like the other monkeys setting on the hill,once there they'd scatch their heads too like the rest ofem.
More then likely tho he/she would be like the other monkeys setting on the hill,once there they'd scatch their heads too like the rest ofem.
oneness
New Member
onecallpowerw said:
The control is already there...It is enforcement that is coming. IF the PWNA can actually have a voice in how that is done, or even to changes in the law, that's something I'm all for. No one will pay attention to a few PW contractors griping about injustice. Someone MIGHT pay attention to an organization representing many contractors nationwide. The larger PWNA grows, the louder its voice.
I worked for a property management company in a former life. We were a member of a national organization relating to our specialty, subsidized housing. That organization has had a huge voice in how the laws are written, how they're enforced, and how they're changed. The President of that organization has frequent meetings with many HUD officials, all the way up to the HUD secretary. Without that organization, there would have been no voice for the owners and operators of affordable housing properties, and that would not have been a good thing.
As you said, it is coming. We can hide from it and then gripe later at the injustices that have happened, or we can HOPE the PWNA has a loud enough voice on our behalf. Whether you're a member or not, you're going to be affected by the results of their efforts. I for one don't think their efforts are malevolent.
Doc Reisman
PWNA President
Mike,
Thank you for your post. You have hit the nail on the head. Your post is what PWNA was intended for contrary to what some people may believe.
I have been very concerned with how little many PW contracts care or do not care about the EPA controls that are about to be set into motion.
450 members may sound big or little depending on the perspective but 450 members is not nearly enough to support lobbying.
Thank you for your post. You have hit the nail on the head. Your post is what PWNA was intended for contrary to what some people may believe.
I have been very concerned with how little many PW contracts care or do not care about the EPA controls that are about to be set into motion.
450 members may sound big or little depending on the perspective but 450 members is not nearly enough to support lobbying.
Doc, I guess then the big Q would be !!
what does the PWNA do >> and what can the PWNA offer us?
In order to get members you have to have a plan of attack : meaning what will the PWNA do for our business?
If the PWNA would be geared towards the contractors enstead of the supplies then you may see a rise in membership. EPA would be a great start .. It would rid the bone heads that buy a wal-mart pressure washer and throwing it a trk. and starting a new business.
How old is the PWNA ?
I would like to see how many supplies are there out of that 450 PWNA members
Is it really geared towards the supplies?
What do you get for being a member?
I mean what do you really get
I know we have been down this road before but now we are opening up a new chapter in this book which may or not spark some interest.
what does the PWNA do >> and what can the PWNA offer us?
In order to get members you have to have a plan of attack : meaning what will the PWNA do for our business?
If the PWNA would be geared towards the contractors enstead of the supplies then you may see a rise in membership. EPA would be a great start .. It would rid the bone heads that buy a wal-mart pressure washer and throwing it a trk. and starting a new business.
How old is the PWNA ?
I would like to see how many supplies are there out of that 450 PWNA members
Is it really geared towards the supplies?
What do you get for being a member?
I mean what do you really get
I know we have been down this road before but now we are opening up a new chapter in this book which may or not spark some interest.
Doc Reisman
PWNA President
PWNA has about 15 companies that sell wares. We have done a poor job in the past in supporting our venders and have been working to improve the experience for the supplier.
Just as we have all read the post talking about how the venders control the organization; this could not be further from the truth. We would like our suppliers to have a voice (not control) but everyone has been afraid of how it is perceived.
Would you want to be a vender for PWNA if you heard all the things posted on this and other sites?
I will use Robert Hinderliter (Delco) as an example because almost everyone recognizes the name. About 3-4 years ago I was listening to a few PW companies and venders (at different times) tell me how Delco controls the PWNA / convention and how no one has a fair advantage and there is no point in attending.
This was my response: Obviously you did not attend the show. {What do you mean?} Did you know that XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX and others like XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX were at the show? {No.} If Delco was controlling the show do you think Delco would let their biggest competitor attend? {Probably not} Did you know XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX had 4 booth spaces compared to Delco's one booth space and that XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX did far better then Delco?
Next:
Again the question is put to me what will PWNA do for you. Many of the people that are posters to this sight are not members so my answer is nothing. PWNA will not directly do anything for those who are not members. If someone is a sports fan and they want their team to hear them cheer they have to attend the game.
PWNA's membership is what drives the board and whom we primarily listen to. I am not saying I and others within PWNA are not open to suggestions from other none members; Please keep in mind if someone came to your business and started telling you how to run it and the person lecturing had no vested interest, how long would you listen? How sincere would you think they are?
PWNA is about 13 years old.
Currently the board’s goals are:
To add and offer better educational tracks for the new and veteran cleaners.
Build an awareness / relationship with the AHJ (fire, health, building, EPA, insurance, etc.) to a point where we have influence over the decisions being made that control our industry.
To build awareness for homeowners and business owners attracting them to PWNA in order to find qualified / reputable contractors and help the PW add more to their bottom line.
Lastly (my want) I would like to attend convention where hundreds of venders come to show off they’re new, interesting and time saving products and thousands of PW attend.
PWNA has many other items on its agenda but this will do for tonight.
Thanks,
Just as we have all read the post talking about how the venders control the organization; this could not be further from the truth. We would like our suppliers to have a voice (not control) but everyone has been afraid of how it is perceived.
Would you want to be a vender for PWNA if you heard all the things posted on this and other sites?
I will use Robert Hinderliter (Delco) as an example because almost everyone recognizes the name. About 3-4 years ago I was listening to a few PW companies and venders (at different times) tell me how Delco controls the PWNA / convention and how no one has a fair advantage and there is no point in attending.
This was my response: Obviously you did not attend the show. {What do you mean?} Did you know that XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX and others like XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX were at the show? {No.} If Delco was controlling the show do you think Delco would let their biggest competitor attend? {Probably not} Did you know XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX had 4 booth spaces compared to Delco's one booth space and that XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX did far better then Delco?
Next:
Again the question is put to me what will PWNA do for you. Many of the people that are posters to this sight are not members so my answer is nothing. PWNA will not directly do anything for those who are not members. If someone is a sports fan and they want their team to hear them cheer they have to attend the game.
PWNA's membership is what drives the board and whom we primarily listen to. I am not saying I and others within PWNA are not open to suggestions from other none members; Please keep in mind if someone came to your business and started telling you how to run it and the person lecturing had no vested interest, how long would you listen? How sincere would you think they are?
PWNA is about 13 years old.
Currently the board’s goals are:
To add and offer better educational tracks for the new and veteran cleaners.
Build an awareness / relationship with the AHJ (fire, health, building, EPA, insurance, etc.) to a point where we have influence over the decisions being made that control our industry.
To build awareness for homeowners and business owners attracting them to PWNA in order to find qualified / reputable contractors and help the PW add more to their bottom line.
Lastly (my want) I would like to attend convention where hundreds of venders come to show off they’re new, interesting and time saving products and thousands of PW attend.
PWNA has many other items on its agenda but this will do for tonight.
Thanks,
Mathew Johnson
New Member
Perhaps a different viewpoint....
I spent a great deal of time reading this thread. I looked at different viewpoints and tried to reach an informed decision about whether or not to join PWNA. Surprisingly, I couldn't reach a decision without digging a little deeper for information.
The questions at hand is - Do I need to be a member of a professional organization that represents an industry standard? NO, that isn't really the question. The question is - Do I WANT to be part of a professional organization that will set the industry standard, not by efforts of a few pioneers, but through the collective voice of the professionals of the industry. Bear with me a minute while I put this into perspective.
Im also a regsistered nurse in the state of NY. I belong to a national nursing organization (230.00 per year dues) and a NY State professional organization ( 185.00 per year dues). I have a voice in both of them. These organizations define the standards by which I operate through the members input. We have a collective voice, and when our administration where I work decided to increase our patient to nurse ratio- we collectly said no. As a member I also recieve Continuing education vial mail, a million dollar liability policy for 89.00 per year and numerous other attributes....... But these perks didn't arrive overnight they came to be because of strength in numbers and active member participation.
Ponder this....
If XYZ Power Washing Company is called into court in a lawsuit for ruining a deck they power washed with 5000 PSI, who will they call to defend thier operating standards. If I was the attorney representing the claiment I would be inclined to call the Educator from PWNA who teaches the certification courses to establish the what the industry standard is.
This isn't about dues or getting something for free. It is about collectively promoting an operating standard and the industry itself.... and yes it will cost money to do this. I can't understand the value of PWNA bashing. If my neighbor Bob doesn't want to join or can't afford to join it doesn't make him bad or an alien. And I hope my neighbor Bob would not be offended if I did choose to join.
A wise man once said. If you want to know if the sun is shining, look out the window and see for yourself.
I elected to contact a member of the PWNA Board in my quest for information... I was suprised, they quickly answered my email and then called me on the phone. If you want to learn how your car works call a mechanic, If you need to learn about how an organization works call a board member. I was a bit enlightened and you might be also.
You are either part of the problem or part of the solution... but you cant be both.
Thanks,
Please excuse my typos
I spent a great deal of time reading this thread. I looked at different viewpoints and tried to reach an informed decision about whether or not to join PWNA. Surprisingly, I couldn't reach a decision without digging a little deeper for information.
The questions at hand is - Do I need to be a member of a professional organization that represents an industry standard? NO, that isn't really the question. The question is - Do I WANT to be part of a professional organization that will set the industry standard, not by efforts of a few pioneers, but through the collective voice of the professionals of the industry. Bear with me a minute while I put this into perspective.
Im also a regsistered nurse in the state of NY. I belong to a national nursing organization (230.00 per year dues) and a NY State professional organization ( 185.00 per year dues). I have a voice in both of them. These organizations define the standards by which I operate through the members input. We have a collective voice, and when our administration where I work decided to increase our patient to nurse ratio- we collectly said no. As a member I also recieve Continuing education vial mail, a million dollar liability policy for 89.00 per year and numerous other attributes....... But these perks didn't arrive overnight they came to be because of strength in numbers and active member participation.
Ponder this....
If XYZ Power Washing Company is called into court in a lawsuit for ruining a deck they power washed with 5000 PSI, who will they call to defend thier operating standards. If I was the attorney representing the claiment I would be inclined to call the Educator from PWNA who teaches the certification courses to establish the what the industry standard is.
This isn't about dues or getting something for free. It is about collectively promoting an operating standard and the industry itself.... and yes it will cost money to do this. I can't understand the value of PWNA bashing. If my neighbor Bob doesn't want to join or can't afford to join it doesn't make him bad or an alien. And I hope my neighbor Bob would not be offended if I did choose to join.
A wise man once said. If you want to know if the sun is shining, look out the window and see for yourself.
I elected to contact a member of the PWNA Board in my quest for information... I was suprised, they quickly answered my email and then called me on the phone. If you want to learn how your car works call a mechanic, If you need to learn about how an organization works call a board member. I was a bit enlightened and you might be also.
You are either part of the problem or part of the solution... but you cant be both.
Thanks,
Please excuse my typos
Henry Bockman
Member
Hey Matthew,
That was written very well, I hope the board member you talked to was able to answer your questions. I also hope the stuff I faxed you and we discussed on the phone helped you out.
You did talk to someone else besides me right? because I'm not one of the board members... I am going to run for any openings they have in the future though.
That was written very well, I hope the board member you talked to was able to answer your questions. I also hope the stuff I faxed you and we discussed on the phone helped you out.
You did talk to someone else besides me right? because I'm not one of the board members... I am going to run for any openings they have in the future though.
Hello Matt,
welcome to the PWN
I must say I was impresed with your post,it was very informative.
How in the world do you have time to be an RN plus run a pressure washing business?
Do you wash part time? or are you a part time RN?
How long have you been in the Pressure washing business?
and what do you clean most of?
Sorry for all the questions................. I just find it odd that as long as this thread has been alive this is your first post.(and a well written one I may add)
How did you or who directed you to this site?
welcome to the PWN
I must say I was impresed with your post,it was very informative.
How in the world do you have time to be an RN plus run a pressure washing business?
Do you wash part time? or are you a part time RN?
How long have you been in the Pressure washing business?
and what do you clean most of?
Sorry for all the questions................. I just find it odd that as long as this thread has been alive this is your first post.(and a well written one I may add)
How did you or who directed you to this site?