Damage???????????????new pictures 02/12/01

Ron Musgraves

Administrator
Staff member
<IMG SRC="http://www.powerwash.net/ubb/uploads/Ron+Marshal/Mvc-006s.jpg" border=0>

Damage,


Why do pressure-washing companies do this? Isn't obvious to them when they are causing this type of damage. I have been in business and see companies damaging concrete in many different ways. I have seen chemical damage to awnings, trucks, cars, buildings, stainless steel & many other surfaces. When is this madness going to stop. What I really mean when will customers not tolerate substandard pressure washing.


I wanted to get more detailed about this topic and really post more photos. Just don't have the time and Dan doesn't have the space to look at these photos. This photo is and example of the damage you can see at just about three out of ten places you go in phoenix.

My trouble with it is you can't seem to make customers understand that this type of pressure washing is destroying there concrete. I have a pretty good program with new customers and explaining the effects bad pressure washing can cause. The potential customer with this problem is the guy I 'm having trouble with. Some people just don't care or just don't understand about what I'm trying to tell them. I try to make it simple and explain if you let this person keep doing this soon your concrete will look terrible.
I will never deny that I have never damaged concrete. It can happen and might happen to me tomorrow. I realize accidents do happen and I have employees. I'm trying to tell you I know cleaners that have been in business several years and still are damaging everything they do. They continue to get hired by someone else every time I turn around. I could mention these companies but I could get sued. You might say you can't get sued for telling the truth. Well I don't have the videotape of them damaging the surfaces either. These companies always seem to pawn it off on another company must have done that.


My explanation is that they just don't care. They bid the jobs so cheap that they cant take the time to remove gum and other things properly. It kills me to see fellow pressure washer doing work like this. I'm not here to argue about philosophy on how this can hurt or help the your little world but to talk with other that have similar problems and find out techniques on how they combated the problem. I recently ran into a customer that was concerned. After the smoke cleared he said sometimes its just not about the money. We have had along relationship with this guy and we are going to stick with him for now. As a matter of fact he said no one else has done there concrete and the damage was in fact caused by him and he said he was sorry.<FONT COLOR="Red">Here's the question, would these photos being sent to a manager higher up do any good? </FONT c>


some more examples.
http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1471816&a=11074799&p=39492881&Sequence=0&res=high

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1471816&a=11074799&p=39492883&Sequence=0&res=high

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1471816&a=11074799&p=39492886&Sequence=0&res=high

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1471816&a=11074799&p=39492891&Sequence=0&res=high

<FONT COLOR="Red">New Photo's 02/12/01 </FONT c>

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1471816&a=11074799&p=40781886&Sequence=0&res=high

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1471816&a=11074799&p=40781892&Sequence=0&res=high

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1471816&a=11074799&p=40781900&Sequence=0&res=high

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1471816&a=11074799&p=40781901&Sequence=0&res=high

http://albums.photopoint.com/j/View?u=1471816&a=11074799&p=39492900&Sequence=0&res=high

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Ron Marshal Phoenix AZ
1-888-fleetwash
 

rvagnoni

New Member
Ron,

Good post. Unbelievable photos of shotty work. I guess the client went with the lowest bidder here instead of going with one with experience.

I do know also that these newer areas of concrete are softer due to the mixtures performedbyt he contractor in order to aquire faster drying times. This will make cleaning cause these types of problems.

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Rick - Deck Care Plus
If people knew how hard I had to work to gain my mastery, it wouldn't seem wonderful at all. -- Michelangelo
 

Clean County

New Member
Hi Ron, Some Pressure washing companies destroy things because they don't know what there doing. I will be getting into chemicals alot more this year and hopefully I don't destroy anything. You call this madness but I call it inexperience or worse yet some people in this business just don't care which in a sense could be called madness. As far as sending these photo's to someone higher up I would if your intensions were to nail the account. I would also carry a portfolio of your work that would have pictures in it how concrete would look if you did the job or whatever else they might be looking for. This is a dog eat dog world so go for it. The only time I wouldn't go near this is if it was a friend that was doing this. But if he lost the account because of his shlop work than I would go after it. So once again my answer to your question would be yes if only your intension was to get the account. In the worst case scenario if you just want to report this to the higher ups just to rat the pw out and he comes by and beats the crap out of you than what have you accomplished. You have to make things worth while to you because you never know what lies ahead.

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Jon

New Member
<FONT COLOR="Red">Here's the question, would these photos being sent to a manger higher up do any good? </FONT c>

Ron's question above brings on another question, do any good to whom, the manager of the location that the damage is being done at or to the pressure washing company?

For sure the manager is going to get his butt wrung out, now as for the pressure washing company, well they might get away with claiming it was done by the previous company.

If that is considered "clean" whomever did it is in no way a pro in our line of work.

This brings up another question for all of you, how many have noticed businesses that buy their own machine and have employee's do the cleaning?

This nationwide company, Home Town Buffet, Country Buffet and Old Country Buffet does that but I am not sure if it is a company policy or regional one here in So. CA.

<FONT COLOR="Teal">Now as to Ron's question and my answer, NO I do not feel it will do any good. </FONT c>

It is a good sales tool for us and an offer of a demo right in the center of one of those jobs should seal a new account. There are companies that repair damage like that too, was watching them for a few minutes when I was cleaning the Budweiser job last month, point in this remark is it would be nice to know of them and network with them.

Good post and pictures Ron.
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Jon Fleischer
Oasis Pressure Cleaning
(909) 792-2247
Fax (909) 792-5633

[This message has been edited by Jon (edited February 03, 2001).]
 

EDROCK

New Member
This is what some of my Mcdonalds accounts looked like before i started them due to inexperiance employees. I MADE sure i pointed it out to managers first.There are washers (socalled)that do this type of thing here everyday.I did it to my own sidewalk 1st time i used scrubber had little circles everywhere then taught mysellf how NOT to do that again.USE THIS INFO FOR COLD CALLING IT WORKS.ED

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Ron Musgraves

Administrator
Staff member
Edrock,

That McDonalds that was damaged did you get the customers to sign that there was previous damage?


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Ron Marshal Phoenix AZ
1-888-fleetwash
 

bling bling

New Member
the photos will be useful in a sales presentation, it all boils down to educating the customers and when these kinds of damages occur i feel it makes the industry as a whole look bad when in fact its just the ones who don't care are inexperienced.it brings back up the old post about educating the competition at first i felt no it won't do any good but after reading the posts and seeing rons pics i for one have been educated so yes educate not only on lowballin but also the damages that can be done to a customer property and the damages it does to our industry.i dont know if it would do any good to send them in but it is worth bringing it to their attention.

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[This message has been edited by bling bling (edited February 03, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by bling bling (edited February 03, 2001).]
 

Ron Musgraves

Administrator
Staff member
bling bling,

what the hecks your real name?

believe it ,i see it everyday. its a shame but it does effect everyone.

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Ron Marshal Phoenix AZ
1-888-fleetwash
 

Ron Musgraves

Administrator
Staff member
Thanks jerome, i knew that but the others didnt. just nice to know your name.

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Ron Marshal Phoenix AZ
1-888-fleetwash
 

Ken @ Pro-Coat

New Member
Hey Ron,
Good photo work! But, I wouldn't push the issue too hard with the "higher ups",(could be somebodies brother-in law, you know?).
Concrete is guaranteed to get hard, if stressed with poor base and water penetration,crack, and get ugly. Most people don't care. It's like tires, we ride on them, then throw them away for new.
How about the prevention side? Clean, then apply sealer or concrete stain; to reduce maintenace intervals and stain penetration, prevent damage, and beautify.

Ken Sisco

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Cody

New Member
<FONT COLOR="e87400">Where's the problem that's the way they always come out???


hehe.. nice pic Ron, That is the reason that my customers love me and refer me to their assoiciates. They know I don't do that crap. I really hate to say this but it's great for business. I know I'm screwed up and self centered but that is one of the main reasons that I can score so much work. You see that EVERYWHERE. Send a pic to the customer and baam you're in there. Normally when i assume a new property I notify the customer of any areas that the there is damage so as they know. I also have the ole previous damage clause in my contracts so as I cannot be held responsible for anything.

BIGTIP: To avoid that slap in a 10gpm 15degree tip to bust gum. I have never been able to screw up with a 10gpm tip. (not to say you won't be able to, but try it) I use a 4000psi 5gpm machine.....
that one's a freebie

GL
Cody</FONT c>

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<FONT COLOR="orange">This Business is Great
Hydro-Emulsification Surface Preparation Specialist </FONT c>
 
J

Jim&Shirley

Guest
Great pics. We run into this alot here too. We have never understood substandard work either. Usually when we cold call we always try to educate the customer a little wheather they have damage or not.

Think about this: We all use water under a lot of pressure. Water and pressure can cause a lot of damage.

Look at the Grand Canyon.

It took time to do it but are they going to continue to let the substandard/irresponsible inexperence work continue? Just a thought.

Jim & Shirley

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Cody

New Member
<FONT COLOR="e87400">YES</FONT c>

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<FONT COLOR="orange">This Business is Great
Hydro-Emulsification Surface Preparation Specialist </FONT c>
 

Ken @ Pro-Coat

New Member
Dave (the devil's advocate),
True, there is no industry standard.For most, no licensing required.That is one reason why, all you fellas/gals who do contract washing for a living must "take the bull by the horns"(sort of speaking), and set standards for your customers/clients to see.I really believe that's why we're all here, and why Mr. Flynn has so graciously set this website up. This forum is a great starting/learning zone for us all.
Ron here, is bringing out "the meat and potatoes" of the business, whether we as individuals agree or not to his concepts/delivery.
"Boy, Ron's photos brought back memories of my beginnings with a power washer and the use of a new gadget(at time)"the turbo nozzle" on raw, mold infested concrete. What a mess I made. Tip size. gpm flow, psi;....who cared?"
Now the real education has begun!

Ken

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Mike Hughes

New Member
Sure, there's no industry standard.......but, does that matter? For most of us here, isn't it just common sense that a job should not look like that when you're done?

Kinda like detailing a car with a wire brush and thinking it looks good! It's just mind boggling to me........are these people totally blind when they are doing this work?

Ron, to answer your question.......every instance would probably be different........some jobs, if you sent the pics to a higher up, you'd get a favorable response, and others not. Try it.......what do you have to lose?? As long as you can prove that you werent the one that did it!



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Mike Hughes
Everclear
Souderton, PA
 

Shawn George

New Member
I'm still new at this, and not very good at following along yet. Need some help.

This is obviously a picture of already damaged concrete. I follow that part.

The question of whether or not to send the picture to managers is confusing me. Are you talking about sending this to the boss of the guy who hired someone who did this to the concrete? Or just mailing to managers of potential customers as a warning? or to potential customers that currently have the same kind of damage?

Wow, now I've confused myself even more....

Shawn



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Mike Hughes

New Member
Shawn,

He's talking about potentially sending the pics to the higher up managers of the properties that are already damaged (damaged by the previous contractor).

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Mike Hughes
Everclear
Souderton, PA
 

Craig Knight

New Member
Well, this will ruffle some feathers, but i gotta say it. So heres my take.

Why are any of you upset that there are no standards to this business? I for one (probably the only one) am jumping for joy
boldred.gif
. I have done 3 estimates this year and one today in particular that the customer was DRILLING ME about my "know how" in this business.

The lady today had a beautiful house, and it was absolutely covered in mold. I mean COVERED. She said right off the bat that it has been 3 years since she had it pw'ed and the so called professional that did it last time is the reason she hasn't had it done since. He knocked out two window panes, blew water in under the doors and soaked the carpet, cut into the siding in several places with a wand, i mean deep cuts. She fired him before he ever got to the second story.

I assured her this would not happen with us, and she said "yeah right, i will believe it when i see it" and to make a long story short, i gave her a huge proposal price, she thought about it today then called tonight and said "OK". She had a bad attitude towards the pw business, but that is what i will change. She will see that there are good and bad in all businesses.

My point is that if the previous guy that screwed up (no standards) would have done a good job, he would have done it (her home) several times since, but now its my customer, probably for life. So, 3 years ago, i didn't even get a call from this lady for an estimate, but now i got the call because he screwed up, and seized the opportunity.

So if we were all forced or voluntarily enrolled into a licensing course, and certified, i STILL believe that that guy would do a crappy job. Think about it, he knows how to pw, he has been in business longer than me, and i have seen him work. He just doesn't care. So no certification will make idiots give a dang about the business. And until all the pw idiots decide to straighten up, i will be taking their customers and keeping them.

Craig

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Craig Knight
www.powerwashunlimited.com
 

Ron Musgraves

Administrator
Staff member
Craig,

Your right, Your right no contractors licensed or anything else may have stopped that guy from damaging that ladies house. Just like you cant stop the guys that roam from city to city robing people doing general contracting and taking deposits and never doing any work.

But if that women had the option to ask are you certified and are you a registered contractor with the state, she would have had better odds.


???? What about the two years she had no one do her place??? Money lost. Who wants to always be selling going up hill?


Great job Craig but that’s my point, lets make it easier to educate the customers and the pw’s.

Oh yah start another thread if you want to discuss this topic because this is not what this is about.




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Ron Marshal Phoenix AZ
1-888-fleetwash
 

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