HAVS Syndrome

Harold Brantley

New Member
I have not seen this topic discussed before. Have any of you had numb fingers after washing all day for several days in a row? I've never had this problem in the past but have had it happen several times recently. I looked it up on the internet and found that it is called HAVS Syndrome which is short for "hand-arm vibration syndrome". It is associated with work practices that involve handling objects that expose the hands to continuous impact vibration. It takes 2 to 3 days for the numbness to go away. That website refered me to another website for ErgoAir, Inc. that makes antivibration gloves that have a thin air bladded which is adjustable. It said that cold weather also aggrivates the onset of the numbness. Would any of you that have had this sensation please respond and let me know what you have done to resolve the numbness. My first thought is to wrap foam tape around the handle grip like they do on tennis racquets. All responses appreciated.

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Baldwin Power Wash, Inc. serving the Gulf Coast between Mobile, AL and Pensacola, FL.
 

TONY ELL

New Member
I to have experineced this numbing feeling. I would associate this with carpel tunnel syndrome. I wear wrist gaurds that have a padded palm and wrapped my gun with a material that is suppose to cut down on the vibration. I learned long ago to turn the pressure down to a level that makes it eaiser on my wrist. If you are spraying at 3500 to 4500psi daily this could really tear up your hands and wrists.If your pain is lasting two to three days I would probably seek the advise of a doctor. Just my 2cents.
Tony Ell
Quik Clean
Custom High Pressure Washing Service<FONT face="Comic Sans MS">Text</FONT f>

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Dan S

New Member
i think you guy's are just old "farts" and cant handel 3000psi.............

just funnin ya guys i know what you mean

get those hand spring thing's ..ya know the kind you squeeze and squeeze...they really help...when you are on the phone,throne,watching-t-v.. squeeze it man squeeze it... it really helps....

BIGBOY------ get your mind out of the gutter..lol

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Washing a truck can be challenging.Every truck in a fleet may require different treatment.Adapt the washing process to the challenges that you are dealing with.
 

Cody

New Member
<FONT COLOR="e87400">Hello Harold,,

Well my interjection here may have already been considered but incase it hasn't here ya go.

It depends some on what kind of work you do. I do all Flat work, usually for 6 to 10 hour stints. So I have a Flat Surface Cleaner to use to relieve me of the wand, but even that may not be enough if your still having to squeeze the trigger on the flat surface cleaner. If you use a FSC often then Tie the trigger open and turn it on and off with a ballvalve, so as you nolonger have to squeeze the trigger.

This should give your hand a nice break. Works for me.

Cody</FONT c>

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<FONT COLOR="e87400">
Hydro-Emulsification Surface Preparation Specialist
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Larry L.

PWN TEAM - Moderator Emeritus
<FONT face="Comic Sans MS"><FONT COLOR="Crimson">Thats why I like the open gun,no holding trigger back alday.With the open gun I can apply a thin like sponge material around the handle and duck tape it on.I apply enough of the sponge material to fit my hand as not beening closed tight plus where it pushes back between your thumb and index finger feels alot better with the sponge material.I used to get cramps in my index finger when I used the triggers alday.I also think the pressure unloader is harder on your hand then the flow unloader.


Hey Dan I wasn't the one setting on the throne squeesing it man haha.</FONT c></FONT f>


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<FONT COLOR="green"><FONT face="Comic Sans MS">When answering Post If It Sounds As tho I'm Holding A Match To Ya "Fear Not" Its Only Lit On One End.</FONT c></FONT f><FONT face="Comic Sans MS"><FONT COLOR="Fuchsia">I'm No Doctor The Pill I Subscride Is For Me Only.They May Make You Jump Up and Down Or Crawl All Over The Ground.Will Try To Help Sail Your Ship Even Tho Rocket Fuel Is The Tip.</FONT c></FONT f>

<FONT COLOR="red"><FONT face="Comic Sans MS">When In Doubt,,,Think It Out</FONT c></FONT f><FONT COLOR="blue"><FONT face="Comic Sans MS">.....triplel@bscn.com</FONT c></FONT f>
 

jschessler

New Member
I might suggest using cable ties they are better. All you have to do is at the top of the trigger tie on without pressing trigger gun, cut excess and you are set. When you presser the trigger the plastic cable tie will slide down to bottom of trigger handle and maintain trigger open, then you just hold gun in a relaxed fashion. when done grip trigger and slide plastic cable tie to top and let trigger go and it stays in the up position. it is the cheapest way to maintain the feel of a trigger gun, without obstructions,in the open position that i know.Buy a package of 100 at home depot and they should last you 30 years....when one breaks, just pop another one in.

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Cody

New Member
<FONT COLOR="e87400">jschessler,, that's just a damn fin idea,,I've used the raquette ball and really did'nt like since it took up the interior handle area,, Your idea seems like a great way. I'll try it tomorrow.

Thanks
Cody</FONT c>

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<FONT COLOR="e87400">
Hydro-Emulsification Surface Preparation Specialist
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Dave Olson

New Member
Hello Harold,

There are a few things that we do to try and reduce the fatigue soreness.

1.We use ballvalves rather than trigger guns.
2.Put three guys on the job to run two wands. They rotate.
3. I'm one of the "Old Farts" that Dan was referring too! I try as much as possible to get younger folks running the wands!

Dave Olson

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Tidy Powerwash Service, Inc. P.O. Box 781, Catlin, Illinois 61817 Phone 217-427-5557, Fax 217-427-2632 We are a commercial cleaning contractor serving East-Central Illinois and West Central Indiana since 1984. http://www.tps-inc.com/preswash.htm
 

Dan Flynn

PWN Founder
We use Velcro, Easy on Easy Off.

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Dan Flynn
Timberland Power Wash
www.powerwash.net
Houston, Texas.
 

Cali

New Member
I use a small bungee cord. Have used the same one for 4 years. Wrap it around the trigger, and wear a brace made for carpal tunnel that is well padded under my work gloves. And I am not an old fart, but 3/4 of my right arm is almost permanently numb. And the other 1/4 is just flat painful no matter what I do. Has been for the last 2 years. I finally did nerve and muscle damage, according to my doctor. If the numbness persists, try acupunture. That was the only thing that helped me. I got half of my feeling back after only 3 treatments. All the doctors wanted to do was surgery and pain killers. That gets real old, real quick. Not to mention real uncomfortable.

Kendra Tillery
Polished Perfection

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Mark

Moderator / Sponsor
Believe me I know what it is like to hold a gun open for hours, "been there done that" !

From a safety standpoint, and a liability standpoint, tying the gun open might not be a good idea. It provides No Deadman Safety. In the event of an injury accident OSHA would fry you.

A 5 gpm @ 3000 psi wand that has been dropped can do a lot of damage.

One option I found to be effective, at least it works good with an ST-1500 gun is a tennis ball with a shoelace going through it tied to gun,, simply use the ball to hold gun open, and if the gun is dropped the ball gets knocked out releasing the trigger!

It worked for me and several others. Give it a try!

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Call or e-mail me if I can be of assistance!
1 800 292-3279

Mark McIntyre: AKA: Pressure Washer Zone Man.
PressureWasherZone.com EasyCleanSystems.com
Mark@easycleansystems.com

916 638-0828
 

Harold Brantley

New Member
It rained today so I finally get a chance to respond to all of those who gave their input to my numb finger situation. I certainly appreciate all of the comments and suggestions that you made.

I have also found that exercising the fingers does seem to help in making the numbness go away. Most of your comments centered on the use of some means to hold the trigger open without using your fingers. I have been using velcro straps for this for several years. It does stop the muscle pain you get in the forearm from squeezing the trigger all day, but it doesn't explain the numb fingers I get in the other hand.

I believe this numbness is caused by the vibration caused by the pump and passed through the hose to the wand. Today I bought some insulated tape made for tennis racquets and have wrapped it around the handle, trigger and the insulator on the wand. I'll check it out tomorrow and see if it helps.

Bingo !!! I just had a bright idea! If the vibration is caused by the pump, then why not solve the problem by stopping or at least reducing the vibration at the source, the pump. The triplex reciprocating pump sets up three sine waves out of phase by 120 degrees. The solution to leveling out the spikes in the sine waves is to use a pulsation damper. I'll check some of my sources to see what is available, in what sizes and at what cost. Does this make any sense to all of you? To work properly, a pulsation damper has to have the correct volume, be rated for the maximum working pressure, be precharged with the correct pressure of nitrogen gas and be placed after the output of the pump. Let me know your thoughts as to this approach to the problem. I'll still see how the insulating tape works tomorrow.


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Baldwin Power Wash, Inc. serving the Gulf Coast between Mobile, AL and Pensacola, FL.
 

Dave Olson

New Member
Hello Harold,

We have a pulsation damper on our Wheatley pump. It is about 1 quart capacity. Has 3/4" inlet. Has a blader in the stainless bottle. We have it charged to around 1800 psi with nitrogen. We operate this pump at variable pressures up to 3000 psi. Our pump head also runs hot. If I remember correctly when we replaced our old one a few years ago we spent around $1,000 for the new one!

Our pump is a duplex so having an accumlator is required. We also have the pump soft mounted to the floor and no hard pipe leading into or out of the fluid-end.

Dave Olson

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Tidy Powerwash Service, Inc. P.O. Box 781, Catlin, Illinois 61817 Phone 217-427-5557, Fax 217-427-2632 We are a commercial cleaning contractor serving East-Central Illinois and West Central Indiana since 1984. http://www.tps-inc.com/preswash.htm
 

Harold Brantley

New Member
An update to an old thread. In March I put a pulsation damper on one of my washers. It seemed to help and the vibration was almost gone when you stand on the hose near the wand (100' from the pump). I relayed this info to the manufacturer and he was pleased but asked if I would try out another damper on the inlet side of the pump. He sent me one free and I mounted it. With both dampers all of my numbness has gone away from my hands and I don't even think about it any more.

Kendra, how is your numbness doing in your arms? This may be an approach that would help you. My numbness was not near as bad as yours but I knew I had to find some long term solution. Let me know if you would like the manufacturers name and phone number. I believe the price was in the $200.00 range. I have a photo somewhere showing the mounting of the damper if I can find it.
 

Dave Olson

New Member


Here is a picture of our main Wheatley pump. The dampener is located on the discharge side of the pump. If you look at the picture follow the stainless handle up to the top and then look right. The Black cylinder is the dampener.

Dave Olson
 

Jon

New Member
Harold,

I too use ball valves on some of my wands, I have no problem with numbness when using them but cannot compare to all the other methods mentioned as I have not tried any of the others.

Yes I got my idea from Dave about a year ago when I was getting that numb feeling.

Should be a pictore of my favorite wand.
 

Attachments

Harold Brantley

New Member
Jon and Mike, do you feel the vibration of your pump when you stand on your hose near the end? Dave, with your pulsation damper installed, do you feel the vibration or is it eliminated?
 

Mike Hughes

New Member
Mine vibrate like hell..........but until I have problems with it, I am not going to spend any money on pulsation dampeners. Sounds like a good idea though.

Mike
 

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