Clean County
New Member
Don't know nor do I care Ron.
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Check out this this free event.
Do we really need a Organization ? (poll)
- Thread starter Dan S
- Start date
Don't know nor do I care Ron.
Tony Evans
Member
John, I'm betting you can't help yourself. If I were really trying to raise the bbs rankings here I wouldn't do it by talking to you. I'd post helpful information in other areas... of wait I've already done that.
Clean County
New Member
Once again your skirting the issues & your responsibilities here. Somehow you also turned on Mike H. & others because of your personal problems with Jim. You got yourself banned on multiple bulletin boards over this(of course none of those bans came from me because unlike you I can take the heat).
Personally I am happy for your successes Scott but for you to try & twist that as saying I am jealous of you because Jim has said your Jealous of his successes shows once again how shallow you are here. Not only did I give you a glowing recommendation as per your request I never bad mouthed you about winning those contracts. You got so bad with this (maybe for a lack of self esteem) you posted to Mike H. & many others that you we'll show us your income statements. That was silly & I still don't know what your point was with that.
Get on with your life and leave your angry feelings behind because we were never your enemy. The thing with you & Jim like I said in the past... not our problem & I stand by that today.
tonyshelton
Member
2008 - Scott Stone teaches Jim the basics of how filtration systems work. Just curious John, what new things are you, Jim and Robert working on in your positions as the environmental team at the PWNA?
[video]https://youtu.be/rfxEFbCd_5c[/video]
[video]https://youtu.be/rfxEFbCd_5c[/video]
Clean County
New Member
None. Robert retired, Jim finished out his BOD term & I relinquished all my positions within the org. against the President's wishes but he wished me luck on my future endeavours.
So to answer the question your now thinking Tony S. as to why I left it's because I see a tremendous flaw in Robert's created organizations which also includes yours. All you have to do is look at the history of both from the beginning to where they are today. If you want a better example look at Doug Rucker. He's a vendor who has a school. He's also your president. Do I think did anything wrong here....No I do not.... but this shows one of the many flaws with Robert's orgs. starting with "A conflict of interest"...
So from where Robert Started these orgs to where they are today--Nothings changed and even the arguments are the same. That exposes one of the major flaws.
Tony Evans
Member
Having a school is nothing like being a vendor. Doug is about education but to give the intense training many were requesting he had to charge for his time. If you imagine that Doug makes anywhere near his production dollars from teaching the school you are even more hopeless than most of us thought.
tonyshelton
Member
Maybe you are out of the loop. Here is Robert two months ago claiming to be president and founder of the PWNA and pitching for Jim to be re-elected to the board. https://youtu.be/H66YVrTH4jg
Clean County
New Member
Yes I know about that. Jim's term expired & they decided to not let him re-up. I was on that committee with 2 other past pres. That video was probably Robert's idea because believe it or not Jim enjoyed being a BOD..lol & Robert is home basking in retirement so he's got all the time in the world these days to just have fun.
tonyshelton
Member
They wouldn't let the President and founder re-up?
Was there a gap in terms? How could Jim finish out his term, (one he "enjoyed"), then run again? Do the terms end months before the election? I guess I'm not understanding how this all meshes with this quote of yours: None. Robert retired, Jim finished out his BOD term & I relinquished all my positions within the org. against the President's wishes but he wished me luck on my future endeavours."
You have made it clear what you think the "flaws" are with the UAMCC. You mentioned that "all" the orgs have flaws. What flaws are you talking about in regards to the PWNA or the PWRA?
Thanks.
Scott Stone
New Member
Explain to me how I turned on Michael and others? Because I stopped posting on a bulletin board? That would just a ridiculous and silly observation.
Please tell me a board that I am banned on? For that matter, you banned me on TGS multiple times, precisely because you were trying prevent a challenge to your attacks on me, and every single one was overturned in a matter of hours. More people thaN you realize could see that you are vindictive and petty. You whine about being banned 50:1 over any other single person about being banned somewhere.
And give me specifics. Perhaps I can explain my position.
Please tell me a board that I am banned on? For that matter, you banned me on TGS multiple times, precisely because you were trying prevent a challenge to your attacks on me, and every single one was overturned in a matter of hours. More people thaN you realize could see that you are vindictive and petty. You whine about being banned 50:1 over any other single person about being banned somewhere.
And give me specifics. Perhaps I can explain my position.
Clean County
New Member
I'm talking about Jim's BOD term. He came in when another BOD resigned. Jim was nominated for this slot which was approved. So he came in for the remaining time of the last BOD's term with an experation date of February 21 2015. Jim completed his term but wasn't nominated to rerun. You need to be nominated to run for any BOD slot in both orgs. Robert got this idea that Jim should run again for some other slots that were going to open up (like mine for example).... But once again you have to submit your name to the nomination committee and if aproved you can run on an open ballot. Jim couldn't get that approval so that video means squat.
Unless I mistyped I was referring only about the flaws of these two supposed Not for Profits which I'm assuming they both are. Vendors will always try to take the top spots just like Robert did in both. This as you know Tony is a major flaw....unless its a private Company like yours,mine & the PWRA are.
You may not like the PWRA so you don't become a member because they are what they are which is privately owned. The "Not for profits" are supposed to be representing the best interest of the Industry at heart but both of them time and time again are ran by vendors which causes a major conflict of interest and you were one of the loudest naysayers about this but today you turn a blind eye.....So history will repeat within the UAMCC like it does with the PWNA... & until correct systems get put into place Roberts orgs have a major flaw in them.
tonyshelton
Member
Hundreds of pages of email correspondence from Hinderliter and his PWNA environmental team trying to force his more restrictive bmps on a county in California. (Obtained through the freedom of information act) these emails proved they were acting outside their designated authority towards their own interests. Could this be why Robert was forced out and no one would nominate Jim? You were a part of this too John. That is a little different than your narrative making it sound like everyone parted on great terms.
Clean County
New Member
No one agreed with your "biased" assessment on that. Heck after you sent that manuscript the outcome was I got nominated(against my wishes) on to the BOD. So thanks for nothing on that one..LOL.
You know I turned down an executive UAMCC BOD position in 09 because I saw that same Vendor Flaw you saw as well & it still rings true today.
You know I turned down an executive UAMCC BOD position in 09 because I saw that same Vendor Flaw you saw as well & it still rings true today.
Tony Evans
Member
John, stop hiding behind rhetoric and admit you're wrong on this. You'll feel better and you might even gain back some respect
Clean County
New Member
Listen noob I'very been here since 2000 & you just joined the other day...stay out of post you don't understand. This is a little over your head & because the way you act & get angry on all these post your hurting this bb. but knowing you like I do your interrupting all post just to get rankings. That doesn't help anyone.....
Clean County
New Member
Tony S (not angry noob Tony E) I value your opinion. Looking forward to your response here tonight. I am considering on seeing if you'd send me that manuscript to see where you came to these conclusions. I promise you I won't throw it in the garbage like I heard happened the last time.
Tony Evans
Member
Listen John, you're only still here because Doug is graciously allowing it. If Mark had kept the board he'd likely have banned you already as he suggested Doug do.
Since this post is about orgs I have every right to be involved.
Oh and what happened to you ignoring me, lol?
Since this post is about orgs I have every right to be involved.
Oh and what happened to you ignoring me, lol?
tonyshelton
Member
I sent the entire thing to your PWNA president at the time.
That was just the most recent John.
The worst was the FOIA request from the state of Nevada. It was approximately 430 pages of emails. In those emails Robert pestered the state to make changes that would make Nevada as difficult to work in as some parts of California and Texas. They tried to be nice to Robert and Jim in spite of their rantings. Finally Jim threatened them for not being willing to make the changes they asked for and went over their head to a regional EPA director. Once that was done their internal emails thereafter consist of making fun of Robert and Jim as if they were nutcases.
We informed the PWNA of what they were doing. I don't remember if it was that one or the County one that I sent to the president stating that he could read it, and share verbal confirmation with others but, since we bought and paid for the information we did not give permission for him to share it. According to my software the president read the 430 pages for 7 minutes then forwarded it to their attorney. On the opposite end of the sprectrum I read all 400+ pages along with some of the other UAMCC BOD who also read most of all of them.
This type of rogue activity that effects the livelihood of contractors and could put them out of business is worth more than 7 minutes of reading time and a shift off to the attorney just to check culpability.
That is the difference between a contractor for contractor org and an org in place to benefit a few large contractors and vendors. Our BOD stepped in, put a stop to it, mended fences with the agencies involved by showing professionalism and representing our industry as responsible contractors rather than a bunch of vendors trying pigeonhole contractors into being forced to buy their wares.
Of course the PWRA gets involved with none of this type stuff because helping contractors in ways that do not produce sales isn't part of their business plan. Which is absolutely fine, as long as people are aware there is a difference and know what their money is going for. There is nothing wrong with spending money on an org that exists to make money off of you as long as those terms benefit you accordingly. For the type of org it is, being that the PWRA doesn't get involved in government, I'd join it myself if I felt the return was worth the investment and if I thought my association with them would benefit my company. They are just simply in a different league than the other two orgs and comparing them is apples to oranges.
We warned the PWNA leadership about Robert and Jim. They didn't listen. Their sheer hatred for Ron and myself overshadowed any common sense decisions and they allowed Robert, Jim and you to come on board and represent them. It didn't take long for them to realize what a mistake they had made. That is why Robert is no longer a part of the org (except according to his video he is the president and founder of the PWNA) and Jim couldn't even get nominated. I don't know your story with them because I didn't have any need to look into it. Your involvement has been mostly that of a cheerleader to the most dangerous characters with little to no interaction with government authorities.
One day you will learn the same lesson the PWNA has, that being, all along Robert and Jim have taken actions that directly harm contractors in a quest to make money or feel important.
Meanwhile, the UAMCC has been working hard to help contractors work smarter, more efficiently, and within the current laws to keep pricing at a level that both supports contractor families while allowing our customers to clean more frequently, keeping the environment perpetually clean as we go. The UAMCC model is a compromise on all sides that keeps our industry moving along in spite of downturns in the economy.
I hope you will understand the difference one day and stop trying to play the victim. You are the victim of your own naïveté that was played on by the very people you look up to. They used you, incited your anger, and made you fight their battles for them. None of us at the UAMCC have ever done that to you John. We fight our own battles, do our own homework, and stand as men in our capacity as not only individual contractors, but as elected representatives of the org.
Clean County
New Member
Mark would never ban me and he knows I push the envelope. Your a Noob and totally lost in transition so I'll be no longer responding to your immaturity unless I dream it to be worthwhile. Your attacks are appalling but not to be unexpected because your Angry with a huge chip on your shoulder. I also know your trying to get me banned because your Angry....but I'm hoping Doug is man enough to see above your nonsense.
Tony Evans
Member
John, I read Mark's own words where he said he told Doug he should have banned you weeks ago.